Fire Control System

Rinat Malik: 00:00:00

hi, everyone. Welcome back to Tech Talk, a podcast where Amit and I talked about various technology related topics. Today we're going to talking about fire control systems, fire suppression, fire prevention and end to do with controlling fire in a residential or retail or any kind of business establishment is actually a very crucial thing to know. And I think it's very important for anyone to be aware of all the technology that goes behind it, what kind of protection you usually have, and how, you know, get ideas on how to how to make it even better than what already is because it is a hazard that is fully preventable. And, you know, over decades, the accidents have reduced quite significantly because of good technology implementation. So it is very, sort of interesting top topic from a technical perspective. And we want to explore this topic with you guys today. So, yeah, thank you guys for tuning in. Let's, let's start, what's your thought on fire control Amit?

Amit Sarkar: 00:01:14

So thanks Rinat for recommending this topic today. I think fire control systems are quite important and we don't realise how I mean, how pervasive is the technology because it's all around us and yet we take it for granted. So I'm a landlord. I have a property here in the UK. And as part of the landlord regulations, I need to provide certain safety devices or detection devices as part of the contract. And some of the devices are like a smoke detector, carbon monoxide detector, and many other things. And I need to make sure that all the gas appliances, which are many and we can we can talk about it later needs to be certified every year so that they are safe for use. So yeah, so I think especially in this country, I specially in UK, I think I've I find it very interesting that they have a very good and strict regulations around controlling fire because we use a lot of devices. So yeah, it's I think it's a very interesting topic to discuss.

Rinat Malik: 00:02:21

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, this is one of those topics that you know, hear about it and you don't realise that how, how is it related to technology? You know, how much technology is actually going behind it? So yeah, I mean from a technique if you if you know something on how it works level or you know, all the all the all the ways different endpoints like for example, smoke detectors, sprinkler, how they're all connected together to, you know, to create a harmonic you know, holistic solution that gives you strength and also makes you think about how important it is and potentially innovate new ideas that, you know, might take us even protect us even further in future. So, yeah, I mean, if you know there are various categories, the way we're going to think about how we detect fire, and then how we suppress fire, as well as prevention, so, prevention, detection and suppression these are not official categories, I think because I did work for various engineering companies in the early stages of my career. So I did have quite a bit of exposure at that time, on the technology and what goes behind protecting us from fire. But you know, I'm not I'm not giving official sort of categorization, but there are and I would encourage anyone, you know, even if you didn't think about it, you might think that oh, you're in IT and doesn't apply to you. But I'm still encouraged to have some sort of basic understanding on this topic. And hopefully we our talk today will sort of get in there. Get you more interested in learning about fire. So yeah, I mean, fire is a hazardous event. If you have it at home or in your office, workplace business, retailing it wherever I would damage lives and assets. And there is just more going around that if you have it as an accident, it just there will be some sort of damage. And so and the thing is most of the times it is actually manmade, the hazard. Very rarely do you see that the weather has gotten so hot that you know, trees around you in the city, sort of automatically sort of combusted into fire. That happens very, very rarely in very rare areas of the world. Getting Australia is kind of

Amit Sarkar: 00:04:57

Wild-fires in Australia, wild-fires in U.S and this time we add some wildfires in the UK for the first time.

Rinat Malik: 00:05:03

Yeah but that's the key thing is those are wild fires, though, because they happen in the wild. Although they're still somewhere else.

Amit Sarkar: 00:05:13

It's due to the rising temperature because everything has dried up. It was very

Rinat Malik: 00:05:18

does it happen in the city area like residential ?

Amit Sarkar: 00:05:21

City area because there is nothing much to burn like you don't have any trees or that many shops are trying. It's very difficult to get fire Until/unless there is an explosion or a gas leak etc.

Rinat Malik: 00:05:34

Absolutely, absolutely. So yeah, I mean if it happens in the wild, obviously we have our firefighters who would do their best to control it or suppress it, whatever. But what we want to highlight our focus today is the ones that are manmade because in city area or in residence wherever people are, they usually have less of a natural fire by natural causes, but most of the time it is usually manmade reasons and if it is Man-made main reasons then we could also categorise it do a risk assessment beforehand. Also take necessary precautions to prevent it from happening. So that's how, you know that's kind of the thought process that goes on when you know engineers designing a fireproof or fire safe establishment. So I mean, Amit, you might have, you know, more sort of methodical knowledge on this but yeah, I mean, you first want to prevent, you know, you have to have fire prevention, detection. If it happens, then you want to detect it quickly. And then suppression that even if it does happen, it is detected but it doesn't spread very well. So is contained. So these are some three main key areas where you want to sort of think about controlling fire.

Amit Sarkar: 00:06:59

I think Rinat you have covered it very nicely that Yes. prevention, detection and suppression. I think it's like with any other thing any bad thing in life like if you want to be fit, so you want to prevent falling sick in the first place. Then if you're falling sick, then you want to detect it. So you do blood tests and you do other things. You go for diagnosis and then in order to suppress you take medicines or you take you do exercise, etc. So it's the same principles I think you've followed and you put it very nicely. So when it comes to prevention, I think first we need to understand what are what are the different devices that can cause or different things that can cause fire in a house. So I live in a house. This is made of bricks, or the external structure is made of bricks and the internal structure is made of wood. And it's a detached house. So what that means is that in case there is a fire because there is a lot of wood and wood is a combustible material. It's very easy for the wood to burn so it can create a lot of damage very quickly. The other thing is in UK you get a supply. I'm not sure about other countries, but it might be true but in UK, you get a direct supply of gas to your houses. When you get a direct supply of gas to your houses. There is a pipe that is coming into your house to supply the gas. Normally the devices that consume the gas is your heating system, where you have a boiler a gas boiler normally and that consumes then you might have a gas stove on which you cook or you might have a fireplace old Victorian houses have a fireplace. The new build houses in UK don't have a fireplace and the new build houses also have a electric stove instead of a gas stove. So they prevent the dip. That's how they prevent the how you prevent a fire. Plus the materials that are used in the new build houses are much more fire resistant. And most of the furniture’s that you buy they'll have a tag where whether it's fire resistance or not. And

Rinat Malik: 00:08:53

yeah, especially mattresses and so far. So far I see that a lot of fire from this….

Amit Sarkar: 00:08:59

Exactly. And the other thing is that between two flats or between two houses which are in new build if you're sharing a wall, then you normally you have some material that prevents the fire from spreading from one house to another house. So there are like fire prevention, like insulating material or something that prevents the fire to spread to the other house or to the next house and recently we had this problem in UK where because of some cladding which is combustible, that was used in some of the flats, like one flat caught fire and then it burned down the whole like couple of flows in UK which is called the Grenfell tower. And it was a huge fire disaster and it just like something got burned in the house because of some reason and then because of the cladding which is there in between the walls of the two houses, which is combustible. Then the other flats started catching fire. This could have been prevented, but there was no regulation and the building authorities had all the rights to do whatever they want because they want to sell and make a profit. So they never paid attention to these safety regulations. And because of that UK then made sure that it is a review on every single flat that shared a wall to see whether they have cladding or not. And if they have cladding, then every single flat needed to get the cladding removed between the walls and that was a huge exercise which caused a lot of financial distress to a lot of people because you could not stay there. You could not get a mortgage for the house. You cannot sell the house if we had cladding in it. And so many people I know some of them who had lost a lot of money and time and they went through a lot of stress. And this is something that could be prevented. So I think the first topic that you mentioned prevention, I think this is something that government and public they can do and take part to make sure that yes, we prevent it. The other other part that the UK Government does in order for us to prevent as I said in the beginning that I'm a landlord is the regulation and safety certificates. So you have the gas safety certificate and the electrical safety certificate. Now remember, fire cannot happen just because there is gas it could happen from an electric short circuit as well. So if your electrical devices for some reason they short circuit, they produce a spark. And sometimes that spark can catch fire, in a paper in a word in plastic, etc. And that has actually burned down houses and I know a friend of mine who bought a house, which was actually burned down and then completely rebuilt. And it was actually burned on by fire. Crazy.

Rinat Malik: 00:11:41

Yeah, so many sad stories. I mean, on both sides, I mean, yeah, the cladding piece. Yeah, absolutely. I also you know, heard of people, people who had lost a lot of money and someone that I think I've heard on the news that someone actually had to go bankrupt because they couldn't do anything, or that they had to do it. And if they couldn't then they couldn't pay the mortgage anymore because it costs so much. So there's a set to give it up. And yeah, it was quite a lot of distress. But I can understand the you know, the overall reason for government mandating this and you know, it is for you know, human life, safety, etc. And then you know, the other side of the coin where we make something like this does happen in just device devastating situation for the person or the family, whatever. And, yeah, we should do everything we can to prevent it. And the things you mentioned, they are quite, you know, things to sort of be aware of, but they we put those things at the time of building as prevention but the reason why they're there is so the fire is suppressed. So they do both you know, the implementing is prevention, but the work they do in the event of fire suppression, but in terms of other kinds of prevention as well. It's not too late, you know, some of the comments and stuff like not to sort of have open fire in a risky place, etc, etc. And also have detectors like, you know, gas detectors and combustible gas detectors and you were talking about earlier about different types of things that there are. So yeah, there are various technology. A lot of technology goes behind it. So in terms of these things that you were saying, you know, before there was insulation that would, you know, resist fire but it would last for 30 minutes, that would give you a time like this wall would last or suppressed fire for 30 minutes, after which it would get verbal and now obviously the new base have more and more like you could last for two hours. And the technology goes behind it are like you know there are two sort of plates of mood or whatever material but inside it is sort of fire retardant material that is also insulin that does two things like it keeps the heat inside in colder countries as well as also prevents fire. So these are quite good. technologies to suppress. And one of the things that I think about as technology advances, right, I mean, for example car, you know, we're building cars for 100 years now we've come to the pinnacle or euphoria of car design, I mean what you do, what do you how do you prove it more, you know in terms of speed, I mean, we could get the air whatever is physically physics would allow before is possible, but then the way to improve it more is looking at other ways. For example, make it more safe, make it more this and that. Same with mattresses and other household stuff. You now have like you know, memory foam and all other things. How do we improve in one that's when you think about how safe is it in terms of fire and what materials to use. So it remains comfortable as well as also is fire retardant. So, so that that's an interesting sort of direction of technology. I mean, we want to be technologically advanced and whenever we think of any product innovating it further we think about what's its main feature

Rinat Malik: 00:15:27

mattresses. So how can we make the mattress more and more and more comfortable? But then that's not the only feature you want to add to it. And fire a fire retardants should always be one item that you sort of check or sort of consider in the number of features that you want your product to have whenever you renovating a product and hopefully there are many innovative operators within our audience. And whenever you're doing this anything that humans use, whether it could be a furniture, whether it could be you know any sort of product that is household or in business or Office, Office basis, you want to make it you want to give some consideration on how does it react in the event of a fire? Yes. That saves lives.

Amit Sarkar: 00:16:16

I think I think absolutely you've hit the nail I think it's a it's a very important feature and it's actually a good marketing feature as well. I mean you are you are adding a feature right I mean for being fire resistance is actually a feature it's not just about the comfort but it's also feature in terms it's like a non functional requirement as we say in software industry. Yes, yes. functionality the okay it should become non functional. But I think the other aspect which I just thought about that it's not just fire friendly. Now it has to be eco friendly as well. Is it made from sustainable materials? So I think that's the next level. People are thinking about that. Okay, we have the regulations. But can we make it eco friendly?

Rinat Malik: 00:16:58

Absolutely, yeah. These are some of the non functional requirements that we should always think about whenever we're innovating. Absolutely. And, you know, with that comes to the next part in terms of detection, right I mean, we have various technology which detects fire. So, so here's the problem. Now, you know, in your household, you have different rooms and you very likely have fire detectors, you know, smoke alarms in each of the rooms. Now, that's all well and good. You know if there is a pile if there is a smoke, the smoke, the way smoke detectors work is that if there is a laser inside each of the alarm, and if smoke goes there is laser you know sort of generator or points laser to a reflector and receiver. And now the receiver is sensitive enough that if it is slightly obstructed, ie by smoke, then it gets triggered it realised that I'm not fully obstructed but there is still I'm not getting the full one What am I supposed to receive so there must be some sort of obstruction and on a ceiling What else could be an obstruction apart from what is in the air? So sometimes you'll see even if it's very dusty, it can also trigger the smoke alarm but yeah, so that's how Smoke detectors work. Smoke kind of partially obstructs the enclosure, it kind of triggers. Now, what about kitchen in kitchen you're cooking and a lot of the times you will know that it's not like an uncontrolled fire because of cooking you burned something in the oven forgot about it. But it's still within you know, within control. There's no accidents happening. So but you know, because of that there will be fire alarm going off very often. You know you family members and the neighbours will be annoyed. And the worst part is because of annoyance you might actually be inclined to turn off the smoke detector which is which is the worst absolutely worst thing you can do then there won't be any detection. So, how to avoid that. So I think a cool innovation was that in kitchens in modern houses or even like it doesn't even have to be true one nowadays. You have heat detectors. So these detectors doesn't detect smoke. And you know, because it's very likely to have various types of smoke. But it detects heat. So yes, you can argue that in the kitchen, it's kind of hot, it gets hot as well when you're cooking but obviously you could decide the temperature if it is unusually hot and obviously many research and you know data collection has been done to understand when it's as hot when it's an actual fire and when you say like cooking hot, right and you know say for example sixty degrees is not unusual kind of kitchen, you know, no matter how much you cook, so, so heat detectors could start going off if to detect 60 degrees because if there is an actual fire uncontrolled, it's very likely that it would reach that temperature so that's how that problem was solved. And there are many other problems still exists, although there are many, many innovations that we'll talk a bit more about. But yeah, I'm thinking about these household problems that we might face every day and then if you have an innovative idea, please do the sort of shout out to DeVos and let everyone know and hopefully that would that would make a great positive change.

Amit Sarkar: 00:20:38

Absolutely. I think yeah, I think I didn't know about smoke detectors. I have so many smoke detectors, detectors in my house and I didn't know how they work. So thanks so much for that Rinat. And yeah, I didn't know about this heat sensor. I know about smoke detectors, but I've never seen a heat sensor. So I think I've seen that in your in your house. And I think that is pretty cool technology like because yes it does. Especially I'm from India and Indian cooking you do. You do tend to I mean, there's always a little bit of oil, sprinkle and then smoke that comes out from the cooking that we do. And a lot of like rich smell. But of course that gets deducted as smoking it triggers the alarm and you have to always turn it off or remove the battery and then one But thankfully, we used to always put the batteries back once we finished our cooking because yes, absolutely. You should never disconnect your smoke detectors there for your safety in case something happens. They prevent that they make sure that you are alerted right on time before anything bad happens. And you know I mean it's strange that we just talked about cooking but sometimes what has happened is I mean, I'm not cooking we just left rice to boil and we are upstairs and the rice boil spoils balls, the water evaporates and then the rice starts sticking to the surface of the utensil and then it starts burning and that creates a smoke and that causes a trigger and definitely oh my god, we forgot to turn off the gas because the rice was boiling and it has happened so many times with me

Rinat Malik: 00:22:14

Yeah, and you know that's actually a good detection as well even though it wasn't finally it kind of detect. I mean, if you left it if you if you forget about something you could forget about it for hours, right? And if you actually produce three hours that would actually start eventually higher somehow. But so those are actually not just annoyance, but those are actually you know, times, you know, if saved your family.

Amit Sarkar: 00:22:42

If the rice burned, then the next thing is the vessel would melt or burn and during the gas that's coming out, it would start maybe it will get obstructed there is a obstruction and that could cause an explosion. So yes, that saves your life. So absolutely never ever turn off the smoke detector because you don't know what will trigger a smoke.

Rinat Malik: 00:23:02

Absolutely. So these are some of the detection sort of technologies that are there. There are many others as well.

Amit Sarkar: 00:23:12

Carbon monoxide. I think one of the silent killers is the carbon monoxide with the smoke and all you can smell it and you can see it. It burns your eyes it makes you teary and then it's a very disgusting smell and you start coughing etc. So you know that okay, there is a smoke, but with carbon monoxide because it's odourless and Colourless. The problem is you can't actually see it, and you can't actually smell it. So it's actually even more harmful. So in the UK as per law, any fire appliance so maybe it fireplace gas boiler or your electrics gas stove, then or if you have a gas oven, so normally they are close by if you have that those appliances then you need to have a carbon monoxide detector near it because carbon monoxide it will it will it have it when it happens, you will not be able to detect it. I mean,

Rinat Malik: 00:24:07

Absolutely the silent killer and it just it's just so dangerous because you will even don’t know that…

Amit Sarkar: 00:24:13

Exactly And normally what happens is when you're sleeping, that's when it normally the reason is carbon monoxide it normally I think it results from incomplete combustion. And also like if you have closed house where you don't have proper ventilation over a period of time the carbon monoxide concentration in air increases especially in cold day in cold.

Rinat Malik: 00:24:38

Exactly.Every shuts their doors especially when sleeping too. And nowadays with energy prices going up to conserve the heat the people would be doing even more. So yeah, very, very enclosed space. And it's very dangerous with carbon monoxide in that

Amit Sarkar: 00:25:00

Exactly. So you'd be you need to have those. So I mean, these are all the things that you can do to detect the type of hazard. I mean carbon monoxide, remember, it's not coming from fire itself, but it's still a hazard to your life. It can come from an incomplete combustion. And that's it can come from a gas leak as well. So that's why they're always placed near a fire appliance.

Rinat Malik: 00:25:24

And another sort of relevant point is that gas, actually the gas that we use for cooking that's also naturally is odourless. They put that smell in there, so you know as humans, we can detect or identify if there is a gas leak. So and so that's also a bit of interesting prevention technology or detection technology that is for us. But yeah, it's good to be aware of these things so we can detect it better

Amit Sarkar: 00:25:57

the suppression technologies

Rinat Malik: 00:26:00

Yeah, suppression and also Yeah, I mean suppression kind of also. It's not

Just the suppression with sort of walls and doors but also if it does happen what kind of technology do firefighters use? That's also quite interesting. And yeah, let's touch on each of the so, I mean obviously we talked about walls, but then sometimes if you are sort of building a house or you know landlord or just know about come across a situation where you have to buy a door, you would somehow sometime realise that there are two types of door one is fire and one isn't. And fire doors are like, much more expensive than normal doors and if you think to yourself, it's looks like a door and what why is it so expensive, but there is a lot of technology that is actually inside that piece of wood that you think it's just a piece of wood but it's actually two layers to go from two sides. But inside there is a third layer, which is fire resistant, and it also gives you time like this will destroy will sort of key, the fire, you know, suppressed for 60 minutes, 90 minutes, et cetera, et cetera. And because based on that, it is also the prices vary as well. And one of the things to be aware of, especially as not just a technical person who just as a as a human, that a lot of the times you see fire door keep shut and a lot of the times we just we just ignore it but it's absolutely imperative that you follow that because there is there for a reason because it is a fire door. It is put there as the whole building was designed that you know, when an engineer designs engineer or architect designs, the whole layout of the building they do they actually plan that okay, all of these points are where a fire could start and how am I going to put doors and walls to prevent isolate each of those areas? Right. So each of those fire doors are not just randomly report that they're put there by design to prevent a certain, you know, source of fire, whatever. So a lot of the times I've seen officers as we'll do, you know, fire doors are kept open with a wedge because just because there is a lot of foot traffic or, you know, but you really absolutely shouldn't be doing that. It's actually I think it's also by law. You're not supposed to do that anyway. But you know, by law, as well as for safety to understand the seriousness of it. It is there by design and not just you know, a lot of people have put a lot of thought into putting that door there to make sure the fire is prevented. So please do follow that whenever you see and you'll see that these doors usually also come in the auto close feature, so you don't even have to make sure it's closed. You just don't obstruct it. So yeah,

Amit Sarkar: 00:29:02

Yes I've seen that and it's interesting that you mentioned this because I realised that in cinemas in shopping malls, you have these fire exits, and they are actually for our safety the normally they are not I mean if you have lifts in the building and because if, you get caught in fire lifts are not the place to go. So you'd better use a staircase. And normally those fire doors are there for a reason and they always say don't obstruct the door because it's a fire. In case there is a fire and in case something is blocked, no one can open the door and no one can then safely escape out. So yeah, I think you raised a very good point that yes, they are there for a reason. And it's been designed in a way so that they can quickly evacuate people from the building safely.

Rinat Malik: 00:29:46

Yeah, as well as also it suppresses the fire. So the fire can't pass through that door. And also it block/stops Oxygen. So these are some of the things that are changing in relation. So because of the doors closed. The fire inside doesn't get enough oxygen so it kind of comes down in you know, without, you know, being able to feeding on oxygen. So all of these things are taken into a count. So yeah, definitely. Now obviously that's the door and we talked about other ways. There are sprinkler systems that you have a lot of you probably would have seen in cinemas because you know in fire trails they don't usually go through the sprinkler system test. What even if you're in an office you know sometimes you have weekly fire drills weekly or monthly. And you see the you know you do the whole routine of going out into the fire assembly plant. But sprinklers are very rarely used because it would be quite damaging to put watering in office space, but the way they walk in as we see as we know from cinemas and just literature that if a fire is detected the central system goes in our signals the sprinklers and the sprinklers put on water to sort of suppress the fire now the thing to remember is the sprinkler systems have a separate electricity line. So the smoke detectors and all the detectors and the whole anything you do with fire equipment, they're not connected to the electricity that you use for lights and you power your computers or whatever. They have a completely separate isolated line which are more fire resistant as well so you know your signals are, you know more likely to work in case of the fire so that's also a separate bit of technology that goes into fire. Fire prevention. Speaking…

Amit Sarkar: 00:31:51

That's I didn't know that that they have a separate electric line because I thought Do you have a fuse box? But you're right I mean, at home normally the smoke detectors and carbon monoxide detectors are battery operated so you just change the battery when it dies or it's about to die and normally it creates it creates a small beep so you know that the battery's dying. And in the in my house we have a like a fuse box and that fuse box what it does is suppose there is a like a electric short circuit or there is an extra voltage going through the circuit it automatically trips it so the electricity stopped. But I'm not sure what happens if a fire is I mean a fire happens what happens to the electricity because then it can cause even more damage right? So does it automatically turn off or what happened? So yeah, Rinat what happens when a fire occurs and you have the electric fuse box does it are automatically get turned off?

Rinat Malik: 00:32:48

So that is depending on the you know what kind of technology is implemented on that particular house but I'm talking about this this separate electric line I'm talking about the one that I know from experience is

Amit Sarkar: 00:33:01

In commercial spaces

Rinat Malik: 00:33:03

you could potentially see those are usually red coloured wires. So those are separate and the colour their require colour is usually red.

Amit Sarkar: 00:33:12

So I advise that how do they maintain electricity in case of a fire.

Rinat Malik: 00:33:18

So that's you know, maintaining electricity is not very important. It's actually better to turn off electricity because as you said, the sparks could, but you still want the sprinklers to work and all the detection systems work. So that's why you just want to separate as you know, like separate skeleton of just the necessary bit which would work in the event of a fire. So that's what that's what it is. It's not enough for a feedback system to work. The detectors will feed your central standard central system has to do something about it. It's not just the sprinklers that's something we see. But the HVAC system the ventilate heating, ventilation, air conditioning, all of these systems and big commercial buildings, all of these things are controlled and they react in certain ways. For example, they stop bringing in more oxygen and you know, there are various things, preventative measures based on based on the building and the designer. They do and so those responses needs to needs to happen and for them to happen. You need electricity. So that's why there is a separate one to facilitate this this kind of situation

Amit Sarkar: 00:34:34

I can imagine because see, imagine if the I mean there are sensors that detect that is a fire sensor, the control system, the control system then has to send a signal to the hydrant system to trigger the sprinkler. But maybe what happens is that the signal goes and then it stops. Or maybe they stop the electricity after that because the system is activated. And then you can just release of water based on water pressure. I don’t know what it would…

Rinat Malik: 00:35:02

That could be a series of these decides what would be the best course of action in that particular for that particular building. So that what you just said that could be a common course of action that is taken, Depending Some buildings are half underground half overground, there could be so many designs of buildings. So based on that the fire engineers take different courses of action with different priority and also based on which part of the building the fire is. So yeah, another point when we're talking about fire drills is the power assembly point. This is not necessarily a technical point, but I would use this opportunity to tell the audience just think about it. If you don't if you decide that you have a very important meeting with a broad you know, in a different time zone and they find drill is happening and you decide not to go what happens in a fire drill or in in the event of an actual fire the fire marshal would count you know, they would see the log of everyone who entered the building and at the time of entering a commercial space. You know, in an office you have sort of punch in your sort of badge etc. So they have record of everyone who is inside the building. If not, you know by all the minute details but the name or at least account of people that this could the people inside the building. Everyone has to meet at the fire assembly point I just want I just want to invite you guys to imagine the scenario. And this happened in real life actually more than one times that someone decided that they're not going to come out because the fire is far away in other corner of the building. But because of that the fire marshal couldn't get account and realize that you know someone is inside and then firefighters went looking for him took more risk because of it. And you know again their lives. And now when you think about another even worse scenario, is that you thought that this is a nice break. I want to go for coffee in Starbucks rather than in them come to assembly point later. So you're having a Starbucks while the fire marshal couldn't find you and because of that firefighters went looking for you inside the fire and then lost their lives and this happened actually in real life. So I genuinely urge you and, you know, to follow these guidelines because they are there for a reason. After a lot of thoughts, a lot of planning a lot of sort of data collection, these things are implemented and they are they do work. I mean, if you go decade by decade, the number of fires events, how they're suppressed number of people harmed you will see a clear relevance in terms of how they will ever do so they do work. They're not for just control to control the…

Amit Sarkar: 00:37:52

Wow that is that is actually scary. And I've been to fire assembly points and it's I mean, yes, in a fire drill. It's fine because but it's also the loss of time. Because see, so many people are not blogged they cannot enter the building till they actually figure out what happened to the actual count. And they it's also to make sure that you remember what needs to be done. In case there is an emergency. So it's actually basically it's like training the heart. You're training the heart to know where to go in case of an emergency. Like how do you open the door how where is the staircase? How do you exit the building? Where is the fire assembly? Point, etc. So yeah, I think Rinat raised a very crucial point like people don't people take it very lightly, but it should not be there are rules and guidelines for your protection and for others protection as well. And firefighters do risk a lot of their lives and they don't even know you and they're risking their lives for you. Huge, huge shout out to all the firefighters in the world that you guys do an amazing job. And yes, there are some people who are selfish, but there are many others who care about their safety and yeah, we know that you're fighting for their lives.

Rinat Malik: 00:39:04

Absolutely, wholeheartedly second, Amit you comment on this? Yeah, they are. They are doing God's work. Right. So yeah, so we've talked about prevention, suppression detection on

Amit Sarkar: 00:39:17

But there is one more system that I think you have missed, and that is a fire extinguisher.

Rinat Malik: 00:39:22

Ah, yes, yes. So yeah, I mean, you know, if you have knowledge on that, but the basic knowledge that I have is that just be careful. To use it to identify what kind of fire extinguisher you're using for what kind of fire so electric, if you need some different kinds of extinguishing, then wood fire for example, and also you have different kinds of extinguisher water, or carbon monoxide is probably there as well. Then you know, there are different materials that are inside them and depending on different kinds of person be mindful of that. It's always you don't have to memorise them it's always written in the in the cylinder, so you can just read it. I know it's a panic situation, but you know still it would make the situation a lot worse if you didn't take that 10 seconds to read.

Amit Sarkar: 00:40:11

Yes, Absolutely. And I think I have a fire extinguisher thanks to my previous owner, and he left the fire extinguisher in our house. So I know that it's a gas extinguisher and as Rinat mentioned, you have to be very careful of what kind of extinguisher you use for what kind of fire because suppose you use something to extinguish can extinguish an electric fire, it can actually cause the current through to pass through your body it can be a conductor or whatever and there could be many other hazards it can actually create the make the fire even more worse. So you have to be very careful about all these things.

Rinat Malik: 00:40:49

Absolutely. Yeah, example is water using water. Electric motor is just dive straight.

Amit Sarkar: 00:40:58

In we are laughing but I think the point I think you I think the audience get the point that yes, you should use the right kind of material for the right kind of fire. I mean, there is no right kind of fire but the type of fire and then it's important to have an extinguisher because sometimes I think that okay, I am I have I have son, my wife is there. We three are there in the house in case of fire happens. What do we do to evacuate the house? No, but there are so many of our memories or belongings in the house. So we don't want to just abandon the house and just run away for our safety. I mean, I would make sure that my wife and my son they are safe before I rescue anything else. But then I would come back and try to extinguish the fire and in order for me to extinguish the fire I need something. Either I need sand I need water, or I need an extinguisher and if you don't have that, then that's a big problem. Suppose you're using water how would you use a water? You need a pipe? You need a hose. You need some kind of system. You cannot just take like a small glass and then go put out the fires that will not extinguish it right? Lots a big volume of water and, and that has to be triggered by the water pressure. There should not be any electricity that's supplying the water and then the extinguisher that they then you need to know how to use the extinguisher and Is it heavy? Have you ever turned it on? And what happens if it if it gets empty? Etc. So there is actually a test that's done to make sure that the fire extinguisher is safe to use. It has to be done yearly, so that the next year you have a fire extinguisher in your house, but you need to make sure that they regularly check if they are operational or not. Because suppose if it's a gas extinguisher gas over a period of time might settle down it might become heavy there might be a leakage it might exhibit. So even though you think that okay, you have a fire extinguisher, but it may not be working at the time that you actually need it. So you need to make sure that it's actually checked yearly. And I think all these regulations they're there for a reason because people forget and these are reminders like okay, don't forget, get it checked. So that in case of an emergency, you can save your life. You can save your house, you can save your belongings. So, so yeah, fire extinguisher is one and normally some people they also have a sandpit so you have some sand lying around in the house. And you can just use a shovel and you can extinguish the fire, especially in the garden. It's actually quite helpful. Like suppose there is a garden fire you can quickly I mean, you have a water hose, but in case you have sand, you can quickly put it over the fire and then you can extinguish it. So yeah, those are certain things that you need to be very careful about and these are the sub suppressing thing. The other suppressant is normally metals. So normally most of the wherever there is a fire involved. Normally people use metal because metal will not burn down as quickly as wood. It will get hot but to reach the melting point, it requires a very high amount of heat. And by the time someone would figure it out and they would try to extinguish the fire. So yeah, so I mean metals are normally are also they can get very hot, but they will not burn down. So that's a that's a good way especially when you are outside and you want to light a fire, then it's better to use a metal thing rather than some plastic or wood or any anything cheap. So that's why most of the barbecues are all metal and the other suppressant is of water hydrant, which is there on the road. So suppose there is a fire in any building. So there is always a fire hydrant of water hydrant. Sorry, that has a separate supply that that firefighters use in case there is a fire in any building so I think those are

Rinat Malik: 00:44:41

I don't usually see them in UK anyway.

Amit Sarkar: 00:44:45

In UK you don’t, But then I think in America and I think UK, you I think I've seen them in the city, a central but not like not like where we live. Yes because it's far open here. So yeah, it's much safer but in cities they definitely do. Yeah, I've seen it in cities.

Rinat Malik: 00:45:04

Yes. And for our friends from the across the ocean. Absolutely do not park next to water hydrant. is against the law anyway, and it absolutely you know it makes the life of the firefighter really difficult. If they don't have a place to park when it's an event on fire and also to have access to the water they need to fight the fire. So yeah. Please do follow the local rules.

Amit Sarkar: 00:45:34

I think yeah, I think I think we have covered everything. One last thing is I would advise everyone to turn off the switches in their house if you're not using an electrical appliance. That's one of the safest thing that you can do. Because normally what happens is when you go to sleep, and if there is a short circuit, then it can cause start a fire when you while you're sleeping. So it's always advisable to turn off all electrical switches when you're asleep. Especially in the night. Most people don't have a habit, but it's actually a good habit to turn them off.

Rinat Malik: 00:46:09

Absolutely. I want to also add something that is a common mistake that people can make in households while you're cooking if your oil catches on fire, do not put water to suppress that fire. It would then it would actually go uncontrollable and you know spread everywhere. So if oil catches on fire, use a fire extinguisher which is designed to for that or do anything else but do not put water in there just to just completely spread the fire everywhere and that would actually cause a cause an accident rather than maybe just doing nothing would probably be better. So yeah, that's a common scenario but not a lot of people notice it. The best thing to do as far as I know is just put the lid on the pan that you're cooking. So if it's a frying pan or whatever pot if the oil catches on fire there is a lid, put the lid even if there isn't a lid, whatever lid is, you know larger than the pot for that it will just start the fire with lack of oxygen and it would come back to control that is the best thing I can do. I know what to do. I know what to do. But yeah, there must be even better ideas from others.

Amit Sarkar: 00:47:32

Very good. Typically not because I would have never thought about that because you're right whenever there is water in the pan and you put oil the oil splits it splats all over so if you try to water it will do the same thing. So yeah, you're absolutely right that never use water. So you need to know what kind of fire it is before you know what kind of extinguisher you need to use to extinguish the fire.

Rinat Malik: 00:47:54

Absolutely. I mean we started talking about fire control today to give you an understanding of fire tech. But I think a lot of it has been just precautionary and what not to do and you know cautionary tales from us but they are still important. But we did talk about various technologies that are behind it. Hopefully you guys found it interesting but also would kind of be more aware on how to be fire safe.

Amit Sarkar: 00:48:24

Absolutely. And thank you so much again Rinat for recommending this topic. I think your experience speaks and we have I mean I have learned a lot today from those things because yeah, I would have never thought of small things, small details that you've mentioned and those are going quite important to know especially when you are living in a house and in case of an emergency is far away. You need to be able to figure out what you need to do before the emergency arrives. So yeah,

Rinat Malik: 00:48:53

Absolutely, absolutely. Hopefully, audience would be you know, be helped by this and I hope you guys would keep coming back to our next episodes. We are a lot more regular now. So hopefully you guys are tuning in regularly, and also do reach out to us. do reach out to us. In if you have any questions, feedback, or if you'd like to join us as a guest. So our details are in every platform wherever you're listening or watching us. So yeah, thank you again for listening today and hope to see you guys again next week.

Amit Sarkar: 00:49:33

Absolutely. Thank you so much. everyone and see you next week. Bye.