Metaverse

Rinat Malik: 00:00:00

Hi, everyone. Welcome back to Tech Talk. A podcast where Amit and I talk about various technology related topics. Today we're going to talk about metaverse. Well, when I say Metaverse, we're talking about meta and anything and everything related to virtual worlds virtual reality in general. But we're gonna mainly focus on metaverse. So yeah, I'm very excited to talk about this. This is one of the one of the upcoming topics a lot of you have requested to talk about it. And we have also been really excited to explore some of the technologies. I've seen some of the I've tried some of the virtual reality headsets and seen how it is in real life. Well not in real life in virtual life. And I'm very excited to share it, share it with you, and Amit also has some interesting insights that we would like to talk about. So yeah, without further re-do, let's talk about metaverse. What's, what's your thought on metaverse Amit?

Amit Sarkar: 00:01:07

So I think it's a very interesting topic. I mean, Facebook, renamed its whole company to Meta. Because it feels that Metaverse is going to change or it's going to be the next big thing in the digital world or the technological world. It's going to combine a lot of technologies. So I think it's a very important topic to explore within this podcast, and I think many people might be curious to understand what it is why Facebook changed its name. Is it similar to the Internet, what happens? What can you do etc. So I think it's a it's a pretty interesting topic to explore.

Rinat Malik: 00:01:45

Yes, absolutely. And this brings me to the kind of the journey of Facebook into for in terms of virtual reality in general. So, Facebook has been interested in virtual reality for quite some time actually. So in in my career, I started as a mechanical engineer, and I was working as a design engineer for a Virtual Reality company for four, five, a few years. And while I was working, I was exposed to different technologies that existed at the time. That was this was about five, six or even eight years ago. And it interestingly enough, there was a very up and coming company called Oculus. That was becoming very popular. Facebook, bought the company very quickly. And kind of invested heavily on virtual reality. I think, amongst all the tech giants Facebook kind of realized that VR or virtual reality or, you know, this whole arena could become very popular and powerful in the future. So they invested very heavily. They bought Oculus and created they had Oculus had their own headset, and, you know, Facebook improved upon it. So Facebook has been, you know, a serious player in the virtual reality journey from the beginning. You know, there were other tech giants also acquired and they are also coming up with quite interesting solutions like Microsoft, they had HoloLens or something similar. I'm sorry, I might be getting the name strong. Google had Google Glass. You know then they are still, you know, investing heavily to get a market share of this, this new arena. But Facebook as Facebook has been serious about this from the beginning. And the fact that they went as far as changing their name to matter is says a lot about how, what do they think about how powerful this this whole industry is going to be in the future? And I totally agree with it. I mean, the more and more our work, life is changing. We're working from home a lot often. And we're trying to find ways where we could communicate and connect, as if in real life from the comfort of our home and virtual reality allows for that. Metaverse is obviously Facebook's solution to a virtual world where you can do all kinds of stuff to live your Second Life to be honest. But at the same time while it's all good, but we also have to look at the counter side the other side of the coin in the sense that virtual reality has been around and been researched on and a lot of company has put in a lot of Talent and effort in this space. And they have made a lot of progress. But Facebook by renaming itself Meta. And you know, calling all of virtual reality as Metaverse kind of trying to take the whole of the spotlight from every other creators and every other talented companies combined effort to come to a really good solution. But then again, Facebook is also creating a really strong and stable marketplace. For all kinds of virtual reality items.

Amit Sarkar: 00:05:22

It’s a interesting take virtual reality. And I think a lot of people think Metaverse is related to virtual reality with virtual reality the means to experience metaverse. So, I mean, if we want to just educate our audience to start with the metaverse word was actually coined by an author Neil Stevenson in his novel Snow Crash in 1982. So that's where the word was first used, and it's an alternate reality different from your, from your real world. So you we all live in a real world. And then we also have profiles and avatars on the internet. And that's a digital world. Now, what if you could live in the digital world with your own house, your own currency, with your own car, with your own land, property, with a job etc. And you can also have a life outside the digital world with a career house, car, etc. And that virtual world is nothing but the metaverse so like the universe, it's a metaverse. This concept was explored really good in the movie, Ready Player One by directed by Steven Spielberg. So it's again based on a novel, but in that in order to experience the metaverse or in order to get connected, you needed to wear a virtual reality class. But that's not the only way in which you can connect. But, of course, so this is the idea that Facebook is trying to explore. So you have a Metaverse, a digital world, where you have digital assets that persist. So suppose you switch off the connection and you go away. You come back a year later, your assets are still there. And because it's a digital asset, you have to make sure that it's not copied by someone else. So you have NF T's involved. So how do you digitally sign your assets to make sure that okay, this is your asset and not anyone else? How do you make sure that people are not copying your asset? So you have those technologies? Also getting involved? Plus Facebook is making one universe like one system, so it's like a game. So suppose you play fortnight or you play any other game? In that game, whatever you do, you talk to people, you have your own avatar, you have your own assets, you have your own social profile, etc. But it's only within that game. If you come outside, outside of that, and you go to World of Warcraft, it's a totally different world. And those two worlds are not talking to each other. Metaverse solves this problem. Now imagine Microsoft has their own real a virtual reality world. Facebook has its own world, Google comes up with its own Apple is also exploring AR and VR glasses. So they also come up with their own world. And now you can buy an asset in Apple universe and then come to Facebook universe and still use that asset. And you can still transfer all your avatars and property, etc. And that is what Metaverse is. It's like internet. So you can go from one provider to another provider, but your Gmail everything else remains the same. So it's that

Rinat Malik: 00:08:37

yes, absolutely. I mean, it's so interesting how this is becoming possible and it's all because of the blockchain NFT really, because NFT is an independent asset, unrelated to Facebook, or Apple's virtual reality or Google so if you own the NFT and it's, you know, sort of decoration in the world in the blockchain permanently so that you're the owner, then Facebook can acknowledge that ownership and give you that asset in its world. Whereas at the same time, Google, Microsoft can also do the same time because the blockchain is a public ledger, and it knows who owns which asset so this is, this is quite amazing how all of these sort of cutting edge technologies are sort of talking to each other and creating this new world, which I think one of the main sort of obstructions or challenges faced by any new technologies is that a proprietary technology sort of comes for what a company builds and then it doesn't talk to the other competitive competitors’ products, but in this in this case, NFT is making it possible so that your own ownership, you know, the assets that you own, are going to be acknowledged in all of these different worlds. And this is this is this is what truly makes it more of a reality in the virtual world, I suppose.

Amit Sarkar: 00:10:15

It's very interesting, because once you have these different worlds, so different companies spend a lot of time in developing these worlds and they want people to stay in their own world, but then people have an option to go from one world to another world and, and just be there for some time that that's the whole thing. How do you live in a virtual reality or virtual world and make it interesting for people because people do get bored. So I want to move from one universe to another universe. And it's exciting. It's interesting, it's new, it's different. So I want to move and that's what Metaverse will bring. So you have the cyberspace or the internet. And then you have Metaverse where you live in your own virtual world. Now, in order for everyone to access this space, I mean, there are different ways that means so currently, you can see some form of it in say Microsoft Teams say people who in the audience, if they are using Microsoft Teams, currently you have an option of together mode in that together mode. What happens is it creates an amphitheater or some kind of a virtual world and it puts your face just the face the head and put it on top of a body a virtual body and it's against a chair and those chairs are sitting in a conference room or an amphitheater etc. And that's like one take to it. And in the in the virtual reality world. You were had a headset, which covers your eyes. And those headsets also scan your face. And it can project the image in the virtual world or you select an avatar and then wherever you plug in, that after represents you and then you can talk to other avatars and they are facing you, you are shaking hands, you are exchanging you're having a conversation eye to eye, and that's, that's another way. The third way is augmented reality or the AR. So it's a mix of virtual reality and the real world so where you're wearing a transparent glass, and you see some text or image or maybe hear an audio in your head, and it's trying to navigate you or it's trying to give you some information, like you see in movies, like Iron Man. So Iron Man is looking at the real world. And then in his head, the helmet, he can audit is called a heads up display. So in his head UPS heads up display or HDD. He can see okay, what's the person? What's his name? What's the date of birth? Where is he from? Etc, etc. So he's getting all that information by looking at the person and that's, that's another way of experiencing this. So, again, companies have still not figured out what technology will work best because we're wearing virtual reality glasses for a long time of course, it puts you off wearing augmented reality glasses and interacting with the world that it's not real. People will think that you are, you're like a fool. You're stupid. What are you doing? And if you are on the internet, and playing around with the avatar, then it's like a video game. So how do you actually make it more immersive? And that's the kind of thing that people are trying to solve apart from creating the world and making it compatible with every other world?

Rinat Malik: 00:13:35

Yes, yes, absolutely. I mean, this is this is such an interesting world and in a lot of ways I feel like this would be for a lot of people, it would probably be more of a interesting world than the real world. I mean, I don't know whether it's a good thing or a bad thing is up for debate is quite controversial. But yeah, I mean, you know, it makes someone's life better then. Definitely, there is some sort of benefit you I mean, so

Amit Sarkar: 00:14:04

people are already spending a lot of time in games like World of Warcraft and Minecraft and, and many of other games fortnight so people are already spending a lot of time in games. And they have a very good social circle around those games. I mean, of course, they're not meeting people in real, but the pandemic has forced people to embrace that kind of reality. So I think Facebook has identified that okay, if people are going to work remotely, people are going to stay at home. They're not going to meet a lot of other people. Then they're going to spend a lot of time on the internet and in the internet, if you want to be social you can of course, be social in a zoom call or a team's call, but then you're just talking you can't do anything. I cannot bring my mobile phone or I can't bring my house there and I can't interact with it. You can't interact with it. We can't celebrate things together, etc, etc. So now imagine

Rinat Malik: 00:14:54

you can't also see your peripheral vision. He can only see that doesn't give the you know, the personal interaction feel of personal interaction. So yeah, absolutely. I thought it was so….

Amit Sarkar: 00:15:07

so that's the thing. I mean, that the connection is gone and how do you bridge that connection in the real world? And that's what I think Facebook has tried to identify that okay, and Facebook is one of the companies that are investing heavily in this Metaverse and that's why they've renamed the whole company and they've told that this is the focus, and they have a vision that within five to 10 years we will have complete metaverse. Of course, it can come even sooner because the technologies that enable it are already there. We have the internet we have the virtual reality glasses, the AR glasses, we have the holographic technology. So Microsoft is actually experimenting with holograms. So suppose you are Standing here

Amit Sarkar: 00:15:42

You scan your whole self with light and then you transmit that in real time and at a very remote location. Say if I'm in London and I want to transmit my image in on a TV or a screen in New York, then that's possible. And it will seem as if I'm there but it's actually not me in physical self. But in a holographic sense.

Rinat Malik: 00:16:08

Exactly like what we see in movies showing some sort of proof of concept of that.

Amit Sarkar: 00:16:16

Yes, it is very difficult. It's very early stages for that technology to mature and make it more cheap. But of course, there are a lot of companies are already experimenting with it. And we will mention some of the links for these companies in our description in the video description for people to have look but I think these are some of the interesting technologies where companies are now focusing on okay, you are going to stay online. How do you make it more immersive for you? How do we make sure that you stay there and you are you enjoy it? Whatever assets that you own? We make sure that it's always there. It's never gone? How do we maintain it on the servers? How do we scale it up? So if 100 million or 2 billion people log in to the same system in the universe, just like the internet, or it's a virtual world imagine 200 billion people. It's not a comment anymore. It's an avatar. That's moving. It's like a character in a video game. And imagine 1 million or 2 million people logging into the system and you have to maintain everything about them all the time. And make sure that perspective everyone's perspective so it's a huge infrastructural challenge well, and I think that's why Facebook has given itself so much time to think about how to solve these problems, how to scale it up. I mean, it's easy to say okay, 100 people, maybe a million people, 200 million people, they can come online and they can do these things. But imagine 1 billion 2 billion people all the WhatsApp users, suddenly they come online. Everyone has a house, so you have to maintain all the houses. Everyone has a car so you maintain all the cars. Everyone has their own avatar, maintain all that. And then

Rinat Malik: 00:17:54

And their Bank Balance, their crypto Balance and all of them…..

Amit Sarkar: 00:17:57

they're moving in the world. So you have to track their movement. Where are they moving? So you have to generate the world in real time. So yes, you can have pre generated worlds and then the avatar is moving you will have to generate….

Rinat Malik: 00:18:08

There will be government and intelligence agencies who will be asking for these data as well. So you have to create analytics. So many things.

Amit Sarkar: 00:18:17

There is there is ….free guy it was video game but it's the concept. It's the movie free guy, Ryan Reynolds, the guy who plays Deadpool in Marvel films. So he's there in this film, and it's a it's a video game, but it's a similar concept like Okay, real characters that video game characters or virtual characters. They're interacting with each other. How does that work? Because imagine in Metaverse you will have people who are real, but you can because now AI is advancing so much. You can have virtual characters who think for themselves. Sorry, not virtual characters, but AI characters who have the mindset who have their own avatar, and who are building who are learning the game, and who are learning the system and they are interacting, and you can tell who's real who's not. And that is very exciting.

Rinat Malik: 00:19:08

Yes, absolutely. That is another realm of possibility. But let's let let's, what I want to do is I want to step back a little bit just to adjust to sort of clarify all the different terminologies and what's what really for our audience. So what I want to sort of step into is to understand all the terminologies and all the technologies and how they interact together. So if I if I go step back fully, I think the underlying technology or what we call where everything else is sort of built upon is the technology which is virtual reality itself.

Amit Sarkar: 0:19:46

I mean, I wouldn't say virtual reality I mean, it's an alternate reality to a real world, virtual reality is just one way to experience it. The infrastructure will still be hosted on a cloud platform,

Rinat Malik: 00:19:58

like of course, the cloud for where the infrastructure is hosted. That's obviously the backend of things but from front end from a how a user sees things. They're obviously they're different kinds of reality. There's augmented reality, this virtual reality, there's mixed reality where they mix both. So what I want to basically clarify is that there are these realities which are not a proprietary technology. This is just a this is just like internet. Everyone knows about this technology. owns it. Yes, yes. Yes. So that's, that's what I want to focus on. That's I want to distinguish from Metaverse to virtual reality. So for the for the sake of simplicity, we're going to call you know, Augmented reality virtual reality all kinds of realities as a generic term as virtual reality. And then, for virtual reality, there are various technologies, like for example, there are Google Cardboard, you know where you could create, you know, you can wear headsets and put your mobile phone in it, and it will display in a way that feels like you're immersed into their world. And then there are various mobile apps which generates this kind of visual so you're immersed into the Google Cardboard. And there not just Google Cardboard there, Samsung's headset display there. HTC also has one, things like that. So there are many ways or many technologies that will give you the immersive display. And that's one way to get into virtual reality a reality has created and programmed by humans. So that's the technology and that's how you get onto it. Now Facebook, by owning Oculus Rift, which is a company who created one of the headset that was quite ahead of his time in terms of technology and the screen lagging etc. and advancing on that technology, they created this world, which is what they're calling metaverse. Now Metaverse is not virtual reality as a whole. Metaverse is one world, just like fortnight just like any other video games, but it's so much more so much bigger with so much more possibility. For example, as we were saying that, you know, different games have the different ones but they don't talk to each other if you own some assets in one world upon transfer, but Metaverse is allowing to have a world where you can create your own virtual self with various assets like house and a car not just house in a car you could have own a sword you could you know create a character for yourself for your, your dream life. You'd want to be a warrior in some sort. You can be that you know, you could be a different gender and different person all together and you know make all of your fantasies come true in terms of different personalities that you want to live. And that's not the only thing that you can do, but for whatever distinguishes virtual reality is a proprietary, non proprietary and generic technology that anyone can use. Facebook created a world which is metaverse. It's just like any other worlds but it has a lot more possibility enables other companies to come into that world and sell their products. And

Amit Sarkar: 00:23:40

just to clarify Facebook's world is not called Metaverse, that's just a generic thing like the internet. It might be called something else. But yeah, the concept. Yes, you're right. People will come and send products on it.

Rinat Malik: 00:23:54

Yes, yes. But Amit, I think I would disagree with you that with you the metaverse is Facebook’s World. And Apple will probably have in other words, Microsoft will probably have another one. They're gonna call it differently. But the leap of technology is that that you know what you had the asset you own in Google's Virtual Reality World can also be available in Facebook's virtual reality world, which is metaverse. Now Facebook first open these, the virtual reality world which is compatible with NFT and all of the other technologies. So they're kind of stealing the spotlight of all the others……

Amit Sarkar: 00:24:37

That’s True……And I'm actually checking online now what it is, but I think they just named it meta, but they are not trying to they're just focusing on metaverse. Meta for now and then let's see what happens. And yeah, Oculus Quest has also been renamed to meta.

Rinat Malik: 00:25:03

So Facebook, the company Facebook, I think has renamed itself to Meta. So now, even though the facebook.com exists but the company that is registered US in is renamed itself to matter. And

Amit Sarkar: 00:25:19

just like Google alphabet is a holding company and Google is just one part of it.

Rinat Malik: 00:25:24

Yes, yes, absolutely. And their shares their stock name has also changed to Meta used to be Facebook. I do own some Facebook, Facebook stocks and I see that then then change the name to meta and now if meta is a company and meta companies. Virtual reality solution is Metaverse is what I understand. Amit feel free to challenge me and audience please feel free to challenge me and please do your own research. But that's what I understand. And so that's what I want our audience to be clear about that you know, you can experience virtual reality in many different ways. Facebook has a really good solution and definitely do check it out. Do open an account and check out what all the solutions they have. And you know if possible, available, you know buy one or two NFTs that is also….

Amit Sarkar: 00:26:29

working the metaverse but I think if there is then I would also like to try it.

Rinat Malik: 00:26:37

Yes, yes. I haven't tried it myself. So I can't speak from experience but definitely would want to do that.

Amit Sarkar: 00:26:46

Calling it's technology Microsoft mesh ….MESH. So that of course you as you mentioned HoloLens. So that's one of the ways to experience So Microsoft is focusing on that at the enterprise level where you have video conferencing etc. So how do you have a virtual video conference where you have the avatars of people, so you're not looking at a screen, but you're actually looking at a person of course a digital avatar of a person. So it's

Rinat Malik: 00:27:12

it's very interesting and I can't wait to see what what's next you know, I'm thinking Elon Musk's project of downloading the brain or reading the brain if that's somehow Neuralink, that somehow can be connected to metaverse. You know, I probably wouldn't need to wear a bulky headset to get onto Metaverse and you know, then I probably wouldn't come out. Not that my real life is. But it would be so interesting because I could design my life myself

Amit Sarkar: 00:27:54

True …True… and that's I think a very interesting aspect of metaverse. You can design anything you want. And it's just a simple algorithm. You just pay money and you get it. I mean, if you want to buy a house, you're not building the house from scratch. I mean, if you want to, yes, you can. But buy a house and place it there. And it's a digital asset that you own in the world. And that's yours. You can go inside you can do whatever you want. And a lot of people they can't own such a fancy house in say in the real world. Then for them, it's an escape, and they live in this Porsche world and they are there.

Rinat Malik: 00:28:27

Again, you know, the limitations will eventually still come I think because even to buy a House will cost a lot of money and the more people comes, the more it will cost so then our audience will see you guys to be one of the first buyers….

Amit Sarkar: 00:28:46

just like a barter system. It's slowly eventually moved to maybe a currency in that whole world. And then like you take currency from one country to another country, you will be able to take that currency that you want in say one world to another world.

Rinat Malik: 00:29:00

This will be happening with various alt coins. Facebook has been on cryptocurrency Libra, I think that that kind of paused for some time now but Facebook will have its own crypto currency which will be used in it’s Metaverse. Yes. And then you know, there will be other currencies that you can exchange from various exchanges. So yeah, the future is looking quite promising and interesting. And fun. So yeah, definitely.

Amit Sarkar: 00:29:28

interesting like how these technologies are getting merged together. I mean, you had the blockchain. So I think the biggest challenge with any digital world and me and my friend we keep discussing about this is how do you stop replication of a simple digital asset? Because it's so easy to just Ctrl C Ctrl. V, in in Windows desktop machine so how to prevent and how do you mean make sure that something that you have is original and it's not a copy? So it's….

Rinat Malik: 00:29:55

NFT or Blockchain solves that problem yes. The problem that was a big problem….

Amit Sarkar: 00:30:01

Tracking becomes difficult. So like surveillance, so suppose you have, so it's just like cash in the real world, right? So you have cash and if you buy something with cash, then of course people cannot track what you bought. Once the once the bank has given you cash, the with the cash what you do, it doesn't matter and no one can track it. So that's why a lot of people who want to do some illegal stuff, it's not. So disclaimer, please don't do this. What we're just trying to say is what happens so people use cash to buy something and it can't be tracked by the government. And now currently, with Bitcoin, it's the same thing. So you have a Bitcoin, but you also have a wallet. The wallet has an ID. So you transfer bitcoins from one wallet to another wallet and the wallets are hosted in some companies. And then the transaction from one wallet to another is recorded on the blockchain. So the Bitcoin Blockchain now if you know my wallet ID and you know, Rinat’s wallet ID, any transaction between us you can track it on the blockchain by searching for our wallet number. But if you don't know it, then even though the ledger is public, you cannot see what's happening, how the how the blocks, how the Bitcoins are moving from one person to another person. Where is it? Moving to? With bank accounts, you can track it, but with Bitcoins, you can't. And we'll see we'll see the topic that we covered last time. It's the same thing. So it is a digital equivalent of cash, which means the transactions will be anonymous. No one would be able to track what you buy.

Rinat Malik: 00:31:33

It's one that's interesting, and I agree with you Amit, that for a single person or smaller organization, they might not be affected, but Audience just a bit of a disclaimer and warning a Bitcoin transactions are not anonymous. So if government wants to put an effort, it is possible to be able to, they don't have to know your exact wallet address, but if they go through all the transaction, they're all in public ledger where all of the Bitcoins had gone. They are able to eventually find it. Of course, you know it for, you know, for small matters, they might it's not worth putting that much effort, but it's not fully anonymous. One thing I would say is, again, this is not any kind of encouragement, but there are some services which they called tumble dryer services where they where you could kind of you know, wash your bitcoins, so it becomes traceless so basically you send a large amount of bitcoin and they randomly and other 10 people also sends amount of bitcoin and then what it does is randomly sends it to a few random wallets, the money you send, so you send 10 Bitcoins, it randomly sends one bitcoin to 10 addresses but it also got 10 Other bitcoins from 50 other people so there are 500 Bitcoins that it receives and then it randomly sends it to different places. So it becomes something that becomes difficult to trace but even then with enough manpower even then that can be traced….

Amit Sarkar: 00:33:19

I think a lot of the AML the anti money laundering. I know we are digressing from the topic Metaverse, but this is all part of it because you will have to track a type of currency in the digital world. If you want to buy these Digital assets, and people will record this on the technology solve that problem technologically. So you have these anti money laundering laws in banks now. And what they do is they track money from one source to another source, and they talk to each other different banks from different countries they talk to each other. And similarly in the Bitcoin world, it's not just Bitcoin any other token or alt coins. They wouldn't be able to track if they are really keen on getting hold. So yeah. It's interesting. These are all the problems that the companies have to think about before they even come up with a suitable solution. But recently, I think there was a big concert on fortnight and about I think a million people attended more than a million people attended a concert in a digital world. So you don't have to go and pay for parking.

Rinat Malik: 00:34:31

Absolutely….You're happy to buy the concert ticket. If you don't have to spend all the other related or associated spendings like parking, like going to our journey to get there and also the food and….

Amit Sarkar: 00:34:48

coming back home. So driving you don't have to worry about that. So it's a it's a very interesting future. And that's where we are covering all these topics where they're going to get combined.

Rinat Malik: 00:35:05

Yes, absolutely. This is exactly what I was just about to say. Amit you also mentioned earlier as well. So we've talked about all of these different technologies separately but in the world is coming to you know the world technologies coming into a place where NFT, Cryptocurrency, Virtual reality, everything is coming into a combined space which is just creating a very interesting world out there. If you guys have listened to our previous podcast, you could have some sort of understanding of each of these things. And we're going to keep creating other technologies that are a part of this new world and you know, hopefully will give you enough knowledge to navigate within this world in a time where still early so you can reach the benefit of being an early adopter. You know, the like, you know how people owned Bitcoin 10 years ago are reaping the benefits now I'm not saying that there wouldn't be that kind of 10,000% increase in what you do. But yes, definitely there is definitely going to be some sort of benefit as an early adopter and definitely do check it out. You don't necessarily have to invest any money but you know, even if you create you know, with your time and effort, even if you create a building at this stage, that might become you know, quite valuable in future so yeah, keep this in mind and definitely explore all the new technologies that's all we all we ever say and encourage that all the new technologies keep exploring them. And if you're stuck anywhere, let us know and we'll make a more detailed step by step. podcast or video episodes showing those steps wherever you guys are stuck. So yeah, definitely keep in touch. Keep letting us know where you're stuck or what you would like us to cover. And yeah, this is this is this is very….

Amit Sarkar: 00:37:06

well, it was really nice talking to you. Again, on a very interesting topic. I think. It's interesting to see where the world is moving and as you mentioned, is the convergence of all these technologies that's making this new reality possible. And a lot of companies are betting on it, people are hearing about Apple exploring AR and VR glasses. Microsoft already has HoloLens. Facebook has Oculus that has that they've renamed to meta. steam. They're one of the biggest gaming libraries. They are the oldest of the biggest games in the world. They have their own headsets. So there are a lot of companies that are coming out and exploring and building technology and they want to invest. Microsoft just bought Activision, the big game company. So a lot of people are coming into this digital world gaming world and they want to make some money out of it. And while making money out of it, they are solving some interesting problems.

Rinat Malik: 00:38:04

Yes, absolutely. I can't wait to see how these problems are solved and some of the problems we don't even realize that their problems and they're going to be solved and we're gonna, we're gonna have to step into this new world and see how easy or how exciting life can be. So yeah, definitely. I'm saying it again. And again. Definitely do try these things. Do explore them whether you like it or not decide that after exploring them and try to understand a while. Doing all of that and how all of this can come together. Yeah, let us know. Give us your feedback. And let us know what else would like us to cover. We are going to be again, I'm back with you guys. Following with newer topics, and hopefully you guys keep listening to us and keep watching the videos. And yeah,

Amit Sarkar: 00:39:02

thank you so much again Rinat. And thank you so much to all the viewers and listeners for tuning into her podcast.

Rinat Malik: 00:39:10

Thank you. Bye